batch.motif.greek-plato-symposium-jowett-gutenberg-l835-l921
---
record_id: batch.motif.greek-plato-symposium-jowett-gutenberg-l835-l921
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/symposium-jowett.md
passage_locator:
label: Symposium / SYMPOSIUM / INTRODUCTION.; lines 835-921
start: '835'
end: '921'
translation: Symposium
notes: Generated from OpenAI Batch run motif-extraction-2026-04-28-high-priority;
human review required.
canonical_text:
quote: ''
summary: The passage is Jowett's introductory commentary on Plato and Greek attitudes
toward love, indecency, literature, scandal, ethics, education, and social customs.
It contrasts literary representation with social morals, reflects on good and
evil coexisting in human nature, warns against unprovable accusations, distinguishes
Greek and Christian ethics, and discusses elder-youth attachments, salutations,
and later comparative examples.
language: English
quote_policy: summarized
literal_observations:
- id: obs:1
text: The commentator states that Plato's authority is difficult to use either for
or against certain practices because his treatment can mix jest and seriousness.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: obs:2
text: The passage distinguishes between Greek literary genres, saying indecency
appears in old Greek Comedy but that much preserved Greek literature is free from
it.
category: relationship
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: obs:3
text: The passage says good and evil are linked in human nature and may exist side
by side in the world and in a person.
category: attribute
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: obs:4
text: The passage uses the image of things growing together until harvest to describe
the difficulty of separating good and evil.
category: object
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: obs:5
text: The passage warns that accusations of secret wickedness can be started easily
and may arise from jealousy or party enmity.
category: action
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- id: obs:6
text: The passage lists several Greek public figures as examples of leading men
against whom accusations were brought.
category: relationship
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- id: obs:7
text: The passage states that there is a great gulf between Greek and Christian
ethics while also urging justice toward the Greeks.
category: relationship
evidence_refs:
- ev:4
- id: obs:8
text: The passage states that at Thebes and Lacedemon an elder friend's attachment
to a beloved youth was often treated as part of the youth's education and encouraged
by parents, unless it degenerated into licentiousness.
category: relationship
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: obs:9
text: The passage says a hearty kiss or embrace by a male friend returning from
the army at Potidaea should not automatically be suspected of evil.
category: action
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: obs:10
text: The passage concludes that an honourable connection of this kind seems to
have ended with Greek civilization and says there is no noble or virtuous form
of it among Romans, Celts, or Persians.
category: relationship
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
figures:
- id: fig:1
name_or_label: Plato
description: Philosopher whose authority and writings are discussed in relation
to love, custom, and ethics.
role_refs:
- role:1
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- id: fig:2
name_or_label: Greek Comic poets
description: Poets said to ridicule and condemn effeminate love, with indecency
functioning as a ludicrous element in old Greek Comedy.
role_refs:
- role:2
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:3
name_or_label: Greek literary writers
description: The passage refers collectively to Homer, tragedians, philosophers,
and other preserved major writers of Hellas as largely free from indecency.
role_refs:
- role:3
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:4
name_or_label: Accused leading men of Hellas
description: Cimon, Alcibiades, Critias, Demosthenes, and Epaminondas are named
as leading men against whom such accusations were brought.
role_refs:
- role:4
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- id: fig:5
name_or_label: Elder friend
description: A male elder friend whose attachment to a beloved youth at Thebes and
Lacedemon is described as part of education when honourable.
role_refs:
- role:5
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: fig:6
name_or_label: Beloved youth
description: A youth whose attachment to an elder friend is described as educational
in Theban and Lacedemonian custom.
role_refs:
- role:6
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: fig:7
name_or_label: Parents
description: Parents are said to have encouraged the elder-youth attachment when
it served education and did not become licentious.
role_refs:
- role:7
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: fig:8
name_or_label: Epaminondas, Asophychus, and Cephisodorus
description: Named as an example of a tie in which Asophychus and Cephisodorus were
united with Epaminondas and fell in his companionship.
role_refs:
- role:8
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
roles:
- id: role:1
label: philosophical authority under interpretation
assigned_to:
- fig:1
basis: The passage discusses the difficulty of using Plato as an authority on the
practices in question.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:2
label: comic critics and ridiculers
assigned_to:
- fig:2
basis: The passage says Comic poets both condemned and ridiculed the subject matter.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:3
label: literary witnesses
assigned_to:
- fig:3
basis: The passage surveys preserved Greek writers as evidence for or against indecency
in literature.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:4
label: targets of accusation
assigned_to:
- fig:4
basis: The listed men are named as leading figures against whom accusations were
brought.
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- id: role:5
label: educational elder companion
assigned_to:
- fig:5
basis: The passage says the elder friend's attachment could be deemed part of a
youth's education.
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: role:6
label: younger beloved in educational bond
assigned_to:
- fig:6
basis: The youth is described as the beloved youth in an attachment framed as education.
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: role:7
label: social approvers
assigned_to:
- fig:7
basis: Parents are said to have encouraged the attachment under certain conditions.
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: role:8
label: example companions
assigned_to:
- fig:8
basis: The passage presents these named figures as an example of the tie under discussion.
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
symbols:
- id: sym:1
label: harvest image
literal_form: things growing together until harvest
associated_figures: []
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: sym:2
label: ethical gulf
literal_form: a great gulf fixed between Greek and Christian Ethics
associated_figures: []
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:4
- id: sym:3
label: kiss or embrace
literal_form: hearty kiss or embrace of a male friend returning from the army at
Potidaea
associated_figures:
- fig:5
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
scenes:
- id: scene:1
label: Assessment of Greek literature and Plato
summary: The commentator weighs Plato and Greek literary genres as evidence for
social customs and argues that literature alone does not prove general moral corruption.
figure_refs:
- fig:1
- fig:2
- fig:3
symbol_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: scene:2
label: Reflection on mixed good and evil
summary: The commentator states that good and evil coexist in human nature and uses
the harvest image to explain why they cannot easily be separated.
figure_refs: []
symbol_refs:
- sym:1
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: scene:3
label: Warning about scandal and accusation
summary: The commentator says secret accusations may be unprovable and may transform
innocent friendship into a charge of another kind.
figure_refs:
- fig:4
symbol_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- id: scene:4
label: Greek and Christian ethical contrast
summary: The commentator contrasts Greek and Christian ethics while cautioning against
treating Greek outspokenness as proof of greater social corruption.
figure_refs: []
symbol_refs:
- sym:2
evidence_refs:
- ev:4
- id: scene:5
label: Educational attachment and salutation customs
summary: The commentator describes Theban and Lacedemonian elder-youth attachment
as educational when honourable, mentions named companions of Epaminondas, and
discusses male kiss or embrace as a custom not automatically suspect.
figure_refs:
- fig:5
- fig:6
- fig:7
- fig:8
symbol_refs:
- sym:3
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
candidate_motifs:
- id: motif:1
label: coexistence of good and evil
taxonomy_refs:
- duality
basis: The passage explicitly states that good and evil are linked in human nature
and exist side by side, reinforced by the harvest image.
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
confidence: high
cautions: This is ethical commentary rather than mythic narrative; the taxonomy
reference is thematic rather than a named mythic episode.
- id: motif:2
label: education through elder-youth bond
taxonomy_refs:
- initiation
- wisdom
basis: The passage describes an elder friend's attachment to a beloved youth as
part of education in Thebes and Lacedemon, with parental encouragement under honourable
conditions.
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
confidence: medium
cautions: The passage discusses social custom, not a ritual initiation narrative;
the motif assignment should be reviewed.
- id: motif:3
label: public accusation transforming friendship
taxonomy_refs: []
basis: The passage describes scandal or party enmity converting innocent friendship
of a great man and a noble youth into an accusation of another connection.
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
confidence: medium
cautions: No available taxonomy reference clearly matches this pattern.
comparison_claims:
- id: claim:1
claim: The passage itself contrasts Greek and Christian ethics and cautions that
Greek outspokenness about hidden matters should not be read directly as proof
of greater moral corruption.
claim_level: same_function
target: Greek ethics compared with Christian ethics
evidence_refs:
- ev:4
counter_evidence_refs: []
confidence: medium
limitations: This is a translator's ethical comparison, not an internal mythological
comparison.
- id: claim:2
claim: The passage compares modes of salutation among Greeks, the commentator's
own society, and continental nations, using the kiss or embrace as a social custom
that can have different meanings across cultures.
claim_level: same_function
target: Greek, contemporary English, and continental salutation customs
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
counter_evidence_refs: []
confidence: medium
limitations: The comparison concerns social custom rather than mythic symbolism.
evidence:
- id: ev:1
type: summary
locator: lines 835-856
quote_or_summary: The passage says Plato is hard to use as an authority on such
customs; it surveys Greek literature, saying old Comedy used indecency for laughter
while much preserved Greek literature is free from indecency.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/symposium-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain source; summarized.
- id: ev:2
type: quote
locator: lines 858-869
quote_or_summary: '"good and evil are linked together in human nature" and, in the
parable, "they grow together unto the harvest."'
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/symposium-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain source; short quotation.
- id: ev:3
type: summary
locator: lines 869-886
quote_or_summary: The passage discusses the difficulty of judging evils by name,
the ease of imputing secret wickedness, and examples of Greek and Roman public
figures attacked by such accusations.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/symposium-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain source; summarized.
- id: ev:4
type: summary
locator: lines 886-899
quote_or_summary: The passage states that a great gulf exists between Greek and
Christian ethics, while Greek outspokenness about hidden matters should not be
taken as a measure of offence or social corruption.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/symposium-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain source; summarized.
- id: ev:5
type: summary
locator: lines 900-921
quote_or_summary: The passage describes Theban and Lacedemonian elder-youth attachment
as educational when not licentious, mentions Epaminondas and companions, discusses
kiss or embrace as salutation custom, and compares later Romans, Celts, and Persians.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/symposium-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain source; summarized.
confidence:
extraction: high
motif_candidates: medium
comparison_claims: medium
notes: The passage is prose commentary in Jowett's introduction, not a myth narrative.
Literal extraction is strong; motif labels are thematic and require human review.
reviewer_status:
status: needs_review
reviewer: ''
reviewed_at: ''
notes: Machine-generated draft from OpenAI Batch; not human-reviewed.
extracted_by: openai_batch:gpt-5.5
extracted_at: '2026-04-28'
notes: |-
No unsupported taxonomy symbol references were assigned; available symbol list did not include harvest, gulf, kiss, or embrace.
batch_run_id=motif-extraction-2026-04-28-high-priority
custom_id=motif_extract:greek-plato-symposium-jowett-gutenberg__l835-l921
passage_sha256=f02c17d768f38861e2b678cfd82826e470e06ff01ba50cf93a7740b213514516