batch.motif.greek-plato-republic-jowett-gutenberg-l12131-l12273
---
record_id: batch.motif.greek-plato-republic-jowett-gutenberg-l12131-l12273
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
passage_locator:
label: PERSONS OF THE DIALOGUE. / BOOK I. / BOOK II. / BOOK III.; lines 12131-12273
start: '12131'
end: '12273'
translation: The Republic
notes: Generated from OpenAI Batch run motif-extraction-2026-04-28-high-priority;
human review required.
canonical_text:
quote: all mythology and poetry is a narration of events, either past, present,
or to come
summary: The passage argues that poets should not attribute impious or immoral acts
to divine-born heroes or make gods the authors of evil, because such tales may
harm the young. It then turns from the permissible subjects of poetry to poetic
style, distinguishing narration, imitation, and their combination, with Homeric
examples.
language: English
quote_policy: quoted
literal_observations:
- id: obs:1
text: The speaker rejects tales that Achilles committed acts such as insubordination
to a river-god, offering dedicated hair to the dead Patroclus, dragging Hector
around Patroclus' tomb, and slaughtering captives at a pyre.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: obs:2
text: Achilles is described as Cheiron's pupil, the son of a goddess and Peleus,
and third in descent from Zeus.
category: relationship
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: obs:3
text: The speaker rejects tales that Theseus, son of Poseidon, and Peirithous, son
of Zeus, went out to perpetrate a rape.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: obs:4
text: The speaker says poets should not affirm both that such impious acts were
done and that the actors were sons of gods.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- ev:3
- id: obs:5
text: The speaker says citizens, especially the young, should not be persuaded that
gods are authors of evil or that heroes are no better than men.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- ev:4
- id: obs:6
text: The passage says that subjects concerning gods, demigods, heroes, and the
world below have already been laid down, while the treatment of men remains unresolved
until justice is understood.
category: sequence
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: obs:7
text: The discussion turns from the subjects of poetry to style, stating that mythology
and poetry narrate events past, present, or future.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:6
- id: obs:8
text: The speaker distinguishes simple narration, imitation, and a union of the
two.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:6
- id: obs:9
text: The Iliad example describes Chryses praying to Agamemnon to release his daughter,
Agamemnon becoming angry, and Chryses invoking divine anger against the Achaeans.
category: sequence
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- id: obs:10
text: The speaker defines imitation as the poet assimilating himself to another
person by voice or gesture.
category: speech
evidence_refs:
- ev:8
figures:
- id: fig:1
name_or_label: Main speaker
description: The primary speaker who proposes rules about poetry and explains narration
and imitation.
role_refs:
- role:1
- role:2
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- ev:3
- ev:6
- ev:8
- id: fig:2
name_or_label: Adeimantus
description: The interlocutor who says he does not understand and receives the explanation
about style.
role_refs:
- role:3
evidence_refs:
- ev:6
- id: fig:3
name_or_label: Achilles
description: A hero whose alleged impious acts are rejected by the speaker; described
as Cheiron's pupil, son of a goddess and Peleus, and descended from Zeus.
role_refs:
- role:4
- role:5
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:4
name_or_label: Patroclus
description: The dead companion associated with Achilles' hair offering, tomb, and
funeral pyre.
role_refs:
- role:6
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:5
name_or_label: Hector
description: A figure said in the rejected tale to have been dragged around Patroclus'
tomb by Achilles.
role_refs:
- role:7
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:6
name_or_label: Cheiron
description: Described as the wise pupil-master of Achilles.
role_refs:
- role:8
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:7
name_or_label: Peleus
description: Described as Achilles' father and as the gentlest of men.
role_refs:
- role:9
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: fig:8
name_or_label: Zeus
description: Named as an ancestor of Achilles and as father of Peirithous; also
associated with an ancestral altar on Ida.
role_refs:
- role:10
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- ev:4
- id: fig:9
name_or_label: Theseus
description: Named as son of Poseidon in a rejected tale of rape.
role_refs:
- role:4
- role:5
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: fig:10
name_or_label: Poseidon
description: Named as father of Theseus.
role_refs:
- role:10
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: fig:11
name_or_label: Peirithous
description: Named as son of Zeus in a rejected tale of rape.
role_refs:
- role:4
- role:5
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- id: fig:12
name_or_label: Poets and story-tellers
description: Figures accused of making misstatements and to be commanded not to
teach certain claims.
role_refs:
- role:11
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- ev:6
- id: fig:13
name_or_label: Youth
description: The intended audience whose morals may be affected by tales of divine
or heroic wrongdoing.
role_refs:
- role:12
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
- ev:4
- id: fig:14
name_or_label: Chryses
description: An aged priest in the Iliad example who prays for his daughter's release
and invokes divine anger against the Achaeans.
role_refs:
- role:13
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- ev:8
- id: fig:15
name_or_label: Agamemnon
description: The figure in the Iliad example who becomes angry with Chryses.
role_refs:
- role:14
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- id: fig:16
name_or_label: Homer
description: The poet whose narration shifts into the person of Chryses in the example.
role_refs:
- role:15
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- ev:8
roles:
- id: role:1
label: moral regulator of poetic tradition
assigned_to:
- fig:1
basis: The speaker proposes forbidding or correcting tales that attribute evil to
gods or wickedness to divine-born heroes.
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- ev:3
- ev:5
- id: role:2
label: theorist of narration and imitation
assigned_to:
- fig:1
basis: The speaker defines mythology and poetry as narration and explains imitation
through voice and gesture.
evidence_refs:
- ev:6
- ev:8
- id: role:3
label: interlocutor needing explanation
assigned_to:
- fig:2
basis: Adeimantus says he does not understand what is meant, prompting explanation.
evidence_refs:
- ev:6
- id: role:4
label: hero accused in rejected tale
assigned_to:
- fig:3
- fig:9
- fig:11
basis: The speaker cites stories of these heroes committing impious or dreadful
acts and rejects allowing them to be believed or repeated.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- id: role:5
label: divine-born hero
assigned_to:
- fig:3
- fig:9
- fig:11
basis: Achilles is linked to a goddess and Zeus; Theseus is son of Poseidon; Peirithous
is son of Zeus.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- id: role:6
label: dead companion receiving funeral acts
assigned_to:
- fig:4
basis: Patroclus is described as dead and associated with Achilles' hair offering,
tomb, and pyre.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:7
label: victim of posthumous dishonor in rejected tale
assigned_to:
- fig:5
basis: Hector is said to have been dragged around Patroclus' tomb in the tale the
speaker rejects.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:8
label: wise teacher
assigned_to:
- fig:6
basis: Cheiron is called wise and described as Achilles' pupil-master.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:9
label: gentle mortal father
assigned_to:
- fig:7
basis: Peleus is called the gentlest of men and father of Achilles.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: role:10
label: divine parent or ancestor
assigned_to:
- fig:8
- fig:10
basis: Zeus is named as ancestor or father, and Poseidon is named as father of Theseus.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- ev:4
- id: role:11
label: makers of educational tales
assigned_to:
- fig:12
basis: Poets and story-tellers are said to make misstatements and are to be forbidden
or commanded in what they say.
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- ev:6
- id: role:12
label: morally vulnerable audience
assigned_to:
- fig:13
basis: The speaker says such tales may engender laxity of morals among the young.
evidence_refs:
- ev:4
- id: role:13
label: priest and supplicant in Homeric example
assigned_to:
- fig:14
basis: Chryses prays for his daughter and later invokes divine anger.
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- id: role:14
label: angry ruler in Homeric example
assigned_to:
- fig:15
basis: Agamemnon is said to fly into a passion with Chryses.
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- id: role:15
label: poet using mixed narration
assigned_to:
- fig:16
basis: Homer first speaks in his own person and then takes the person of Chryses.
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- ev:8
symbols:
- id: sym:1
label: river-god
literal_form: A river-god whose divinity Achilles is said in a rejected tale to
challenge.
associated_figures:
- fig:3
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: sym:2
label: dedicated hair offering
literal_form: Achilles' hair, previously dedicated to the river-god Spercheius and
offered to dead Patroclus in the rejected tale.
associated_figures:
- fig:3
- fig:4
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: sym:3
label: tomb of Patroclus
literal_form: The tomb around which Hector is said in the rejected tale to have
been dragged.
associated_figures:
- fig:3
- fig:4
- fig:5
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: sym:4
label: funeral pyre
literal_form: The pyre at which captives are said in the rejected tale to have been
slaughtered.
associated_figures:
- fig:3
- fig:4
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: sym:5
label: ancestral altar of Zeus on Ida
literal_form: An altar of Zeus described as aloft in air on the peak of Ida.
associated_figures:
- fig:8
taxonomy_refs:
- mountain
evidence_refs:
- ev:4
- id: sym:6
label: voice and gesture
literal_form: The means by which a poet assimilates himself to another person in
imitation.
associated_figures:
- fig:16
taxonomy_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:8
scenes:
- id: scene:1
label: Rejection of Achilles' alleged impiety
summary: The speaker says citizens should not believe allegations that Achilles
committed impious or cruel acts against river-gods, Patroclus, Hector, or captives,
given his education and divine lineage.
figure_refs:
- fig:1
- fig:3
- fig:4
- fig:5
- fig:6
- fig:7
- fig:8
symbol_refs:
- sym:1
- sym:2
- sym:3
- sym:4
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- id: scene:2
label: Regulation of tales about divine-born heroes
summary: The speaker rejects tales of Theseus and Peirithous committing rape and
says poets must not both attribute such acts to heroes and call them sons of gods.
figure_refs:
- fig:1
- fig:8
- fig:9
- fig:10
- fig:11
- fig:12
- fig:13
symbol_refs:
- sym:5
evidence_refs:
- ev:2
- ev:3
- ev:4
- id: scene:3
label: Justice and the treatment of human subjects
summary: The speakers note that the treatment of men in poetry cannot be settled
until justice and its advantage to the possessor have been discovered.
figure_refs:
- fig:1
- fig:12
symbol_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:5
- id: scene:4
label: Classification of poetic style
summary: The discussion moves from subject matter to style, defining mythology and
poetry as narration and distinguishing simple narration, imitation, and their
union.
figure_refs:
- fig:1
- fig:2
symbol_refs: []
evidence_refs:
- ev:6
- id: scene:5
label: Homeric example of imitation
summary: The speaker uses the opening of the Iliad to show how Homer first narrates
in his own person and then assumes the person of Chryses, defining this assimilation
by voice or gesture as imitation.
figure_refs:
- fig:1
- fig:14
- fig:15
- fig:16
symbol_refs:
- sym:6
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- ev:8
candidate_motifs:
- id: motif:1
label: Divine-born hero constrained by moral theology
taxonomy_refs:
- divine_parent_child
basis: The passage discusses heroes identified as children or descendants of gods
and argues that poets must not portray them as committing impious and dreadful
acts while also calling them divine offspring.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- ev:3
confidence: medium
cautions: This is a philosophical prescription about mythic representation, not
a narrative episode endorsing the heroic deeds.
- id: motif:2
label: Denial that gods are authors of evil
taxonomy_refs:
- wisdom
basis: The speaker explicitly says citizens should not be persuaded that gods are
authors of evil and presents this as a rule for poetic education.
evidence_refs:
- ev:3
confidence: medium
cautions: The taxonomy reference is approximate; the passage is ethical and theological
argument rather than a mythic action motif.
- id: motif:3
label: Funerary violence and offering at a hero's pyre
taxonomy_refs:
- sacrifice
basis: The rejected Achilles tale includes an offering of hair to dead Patroclus
and slaughter of captives at the pyre.
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
confidence: low
cautions: The speaker explicitly refuses to believe Achilles was guilty of these
acts; the motif is present only as a cited tale to be censored.
- id: motif:4
label: Poet assuming another person through imitation
taxonomy_refs: []
basis: The passage identifies imitation as the poet's assimilation to another person
by voice or gesture and illustrates it with Homer taking the person of Chryses.
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- ev:8
confidence: high
cautions: This is a literary pattern rather than one of the supplied mythic motif
families.
comparison_claims:
- id: claim:1
claim: The passage treats Homeric epic as an example of a mixed narrative mode in
which authorial narration alternates with assumed speech in another person's character.
claim_level: same_function
target: Homeric Iliad and Odyssey narrative practice
evidence_refs:
- ev:7
- ev:8
counter_evidence_refs: []
confidence: high
limitations: The comparison is internal to the passage's literary analysis and does
not establish historical development or broader cross-cultural recurrence.
- id: claim:2
claim: The Achilles and Theseus-Peirithous examples are grouped as tales of divine-related
heroes whose immoral actions would be pedagogically harmful if accepted.
claim_level: same_function
target: Greek heroic tales about divine-born figures committing impious or immoral
acts
evidence_refs:
- ev:1
- ev:2
- ev:3
- ev:4
counter_evidence_refs: []
confidence: medium
limitations: The passage groups these examples for moral censorship; it does not
narrate the full myths or claim a shared origin.
evidence:
- id: ev:1
type: summary
locator: 12131-12147
quote_or_summary: The speaker rejects allegations that Achilles challenged a river-god,
offered dedicated hair to dead Patroclus, dragged Hector around Patroclus' tomb,
and slaughtered captives at the pyre; Achilles is described as Cheiron's pupil,
son of a goddess and Peleus, and descended from Zeus.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; summarized.
- id: ev:2
type: summary
locator: 12151-12159
quote_or_summary: The speaker says tales of Theseus son of Poseidon or Peirithous
son of Zeus committing rape should not be believed or repeated, and poets must
say either the acts were not done or the actors were not sons of gods.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; summarized.
- id: ev:3
type: quote
locator: 12159-12164
quote_or_summary: '"We will not have them trying to persuade our youth that the
gods are the authors of evil, and that heroes are no better than men"'
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; short quotation.
- id: ev:4
type: summary
locator: 12167-12179
quote_or_summary: The speaker says such tales may lead hearers to excuse their own
vices; verses mention kindred of the gods, relatives of Zeus, Zeus' altar on Ida,
and divine blood in their veins; the speaker says to end such tales lest they
produce lax morals among the young.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; summarized.
- id: ev:5
type: summary
locator: 12183-12214
quote_or_summary: The speakers say the treatment of gods, demigods, heroes, and
the world below has been laid down; discussion of men remains, including claims
about wicked men being happy and justice or injustice, but this cannot be settled
until justice is discovered.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; summarized.
- id: ev:6
type: quote
locator: 12216-12239
quote_or_summary: The discussion turns to style; the speaker says, "all mythology
and poetry is a narration of events, either past, present, or to come," and distinguishes
simple narration, imitation, and their union.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; short quotation with summary.
- id: ev:7
type: summary
locator: 12242-12262
quote_or_summary: Using the first lines of the Iliad, the speaker recounts that
Chryses prayed to Agamemnon to release his daughter, Agamemnon became angry, and
Chryses invoked divine anger against the Achaeans; Homer first speaks in his own
person and then takes the person of Chryses.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; summarized.
- id: ev:8
type: summary
locator: 12264-12273
quote_or_summary: The speaker says a poet who speaks in another's person assimilates
his style to that person; assimilation by voice or gesture is imitation of the
assumed character.
source_text_path: texts/public-domain/greek/project-gutenberg/republic-jowett.md
rights_note: Public domain translation; summarized.
confidence:
extraction: high
motif_candidates: medium
comparison_claims: medium
notes: The passage is primarily philosophical and literary-theoretical, so mythic
motifs appear mostly as cited examples to be rejected or regulated rather than
as narrated events.
reviewer_status:
status: needs_review
reviewer: ''
reviewed_at: ''
notes: Machine-generated draft from OpenAI Batch; not human-reviewed.
extracted_by: openai_batch:gpt-5.5
extracted_at: '2026-04-28'
notes: |-
Only the provided passage and metadata were used. Rejected tales are treated as cited mythic content, not as endorsed narrative facts.
batch_run_id=motif-extraction-2026-04-28-high-priority
custom_id=motif_extract:greek-plato-republic-jowett-gutenberg__l12131-l12273
passage_sha256=e3406c53a49472578040f7e8211beffa576c113a7130fa7f35ffd9d1197a5ce7